Political Dissent Can Bring Federal Agents To Door

Political Dissent Can Bring Federal Agents To Door
Posted by FoM on January 11, 2002 at 09:20:06 PT
By Kris Axtman, Staff Writer of The CSM
Source: Christian Science Monitor
It was 10:30 a.m. on Nov. 7 when the two men showed up. Donna Huanca was alone, getting ready to open Houston's Art Car Museum. "They looked like robots," she says.She told the men, dressed in dark suits and carrying leather portfolios, that they would have to wait until the doors opened at 11. That was when they flipped out their badges: They were federal agents investigating reports of "anti-American activity" at the tiny art gallery.
To FBI special agent Terrence Donahue and Steven Smith of the Secret Service, it was a routine mission to check out one of the more than 435,000 tips they have received since Sept. 11.To Ms. Huanca, whose gallery was opening "Secret Wars," an exhibit on US covert operations and government secrets, it was something else. "What's anti-American about freedom of speech?" the docent blurted out.The incident, which ended after an hour of questioning, represents more than just a disturbing day for one museum staffer. Across the US, growing numbers of Americans are facing similar interrogations - apparently, they say, because they have criticized the government, President Bush, or the war on terrorism.Not everyone is bothered by the inquiries. Indeed, by responding to a torrent of tips federal agents are doing exactly what many Americans want them to do.But as the nation mounts a zealous campaign against domestic terror, some observers say federal agencies are walking a delicate line between checking out leads and trampling on free speech."If the FBI is investigating art exhibits at museums, then the line has been crossed," says First Amendment scholar David Cole at Georgetown University in Washington. "The FBI should investigate any credible leads where federal criminal activity may be undertaken. But it should avoid investigating any political conduct."The rise in doorstep inquiries reflects, in part, a new law-enforcement reality. Suddenly, it may seem hard to know who might be the next to steer a plane into a building. It also reflects raw math. There are simply many more tips to check."Remarks made toward the president in an antagonistic way are checked out by the Secret Service. That's always been the case," says Jill Spillman, an FBI agent detailed to the Justice Department. "The FBI checks out [possible] domestic terrorism." She says the people visited are under no obligation to answer questions and are not necessarily viewed as suspects.But Attorney General John Ashcroft's post-September policy is that each tip be looked into. While not every tip leads to a face-to-face visit, surprise encounters with federal agents are leaving some Americans feeling their privacy has been violated - and that their speech has made them targets of official scrutiny.For example, A.J. Brown, a student at Durham Technical Community College in North Carolina, faced 40 minutes of grilling by two Secret Service agents and a Raleigh police officer in her doorway (she wouldn't let them come in, and they had no search warrant). By her account, they said they were investigating a tip that she had "un-American material" in her apartment. From the doorway, they took particular note of a poster of George W. Bush holding a noose. It read: "We hang on your every word," referring to his unflinching support of the death penalty as governor of Texas.Then there's San Franciscan Barry Reingold, who was awakened from his afternoon nap by a buzzing intercom on Oct. 23. He called down to the street to find out who it was. "The FBI," was the response. He buzzed the two men up, but decided to meet them in the hall. "I was a little bit shaken up," says Mr. Reingold. "I mean, why would the FBI be interested in me, a 60-year-old retired phone company worker?"When they asked if he worked out at a certain gym, he realized the reason behind the visit. The gym is where he lifts weights - and expounds on his political views.Since Sept. 11, the sessions have been heated. Once, he recalls, "discussion turned to [Osama] bin Laden and what a horrible murderer he was. I said, 'Yeah, he's horrible and did a horrible thing, but Bush has nothing to be proud of. He is a servant of the big oil companies, and his only interest in the Middle East is oil.' "Some fellow weightlifters called Reingold a disloyal American. One, apparently, called the government.So it was that two agents were standing in his hall. "They said, 'You know you are entitled to freedom of speech.' And I said, 'Thank you. That ends our conversation.' " When Reingold closed his door, he heard one of the agents say: "But we still need to do a report."As the overheard comment suggests, the FBI and Secret Service view many of these checkups as a routine, almost innocuous, part of their job.Still, the task has taken on fresh relevance after the terrorist attacks."Just because we [talked] to ABC Flight School doesn't mean they did something wrong," says Robert Doguim of the Houston FBI. "But how irresponsible of us would it be if we didn't talk to someone?"He says the Art Car Museum and its exhibit (which had been planned months before Sept. 11) were deemed "not dangerous" after the agents' visit.But to Huanca, the face-off seemed unnecessary and intimidating. She says the G-men puzzled over each art installation, sneering and saying things like, "What's that supposed to mean?"Drawing conclusions from cases like this is tricky, since the reality could involve more, or less, than either side tells the media. But Barry Steinhardt, associate director of the American Civil Liberties Union in Washington, finds the anecdotal evidence deeply troubling."All of this speaks to the new McCarthyism, where political dissent is being equaled to treason," Mr. Steinhardt says. "It's a very frightening trend: that people are doing nothing more than expressing the very freedoms that we are fighting to preserve - and find themselves with the FBI at their door."Newshawk: Nicholas Thimmesch IINORML Communications DirectorSource: Christian Science Monitor (US)Author: Kris Axtman, Staff Writer of The CSMPublished: January 08, 2002 EditionCopyright: 2002 The Christian Science Publishing SocietyContact: oped csps.comWebsite: Articles:FBI Focus on Terrorism Sidelines Other Categories Rushes To Remake Its Mission
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Comment #19 posted by Sandino on January 12, 2002 at 15:14:18 PT:
"Our Story So Far"
Here'a little ditty that I found over at Conspiracy Nation that I think some of you might find of interest.(Conspiracy Nation, 12/01/01)--For those who've tuned in late, here is our story so far:Telemarketers and mass mailings besieged Americans with offers of easy credit during the 1990's, it was called the "New Economy."Myopic economists focused on minutiae did not notice the giant iceburg approaching off the port bow.With the iceburg having struck the ship, the myopic economiists needed a scapegoat for financial disaster.U.S. secret security agencies such as the CIA, the FBI and the NSA allowed a startling terror attack to slam into the World Trade Center on September 11, 2001. Two days before it happened, they had "no foreknowledge"; within 48 hours of the event, they had solved the crime: the guilty party was Osama Bin Laden.Tragic pathos: if only the solution to the crime had come just 72 hours sooner.For failing to prevent the 9-11 tragedy, the CIA, FBI and NSA were rewarded with more money from the government.Killing two birds with one stone, the Bin Laden scapegoat justified intervention in Afghanistan to secure control over Caspian Sea oil. Not only is Bin Laden to blame for massive layoffs in the U.S., but since he and the Taliban (or do we say Taleban?) had turned down a deal favoring Unocal, the scapegoat of 9-11 served to permit capture of a planned oil pipeline.Killing three birds with one stone, Osama (or do we say Usama?) and his cutoff of Afghan opium could be reversed-- oh that Osama! The breaded bey and his band of believers had halted poppy growing. Now thanks to U.S.-led intervention, the poppies are being planted once more.Are you unhappy about anything? It could be due to Osama Bin Laden.Bad back? Hernia? The heartbreak of psoriasis? Associate that with Mr. Bin Laden, carrying mankind's sins into a cavern.Americans are stupider than ever? "Thank you Mr. Bin Laden," says Dick Cheney, as he winks to Bush the First.And now on with the show...........
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Comment #18 posted by Rainbow on January 12, 2002 at 12:05:04 PT
Anthrax case
As with the FBI agents who knew about the terrorist attacks in OK and NYC and DC the information is probably being suspressed.The FBI agents tried to warn us but were told by the top FBI folks to drop it. The FBI agents were supposedly from the Minnesota area. Then again it might be a conspiracy theory. But a lawyer from the Klinton impeachment days was the one communicating or trying to communicate the potential (turned real) disasters.So since the anthrax thing can be suppressed it will. We have seen tidbits that suggest it was an inside job with American made anthrax. Maybe it takes time to find the perpetrator or maybe they are sitting on information that will not be known.Who knows because one thing I am finding is we can not trust our government to tell the truth. Look at ONDCP, DEA(th), etc etc.Cheers
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Comment #17 posted by FoM on January 12, 2002 at 10:20:35 PT
I've been wondering about who is responsible for attempting to kill far more people then were lost on 9-11 with sophisticated Anthrax spores. Why don't we hear more about finding out who the terrorst is concerning the Anthrax mailings?
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Comment #16 posted by Lehder on January 12, 2002 at 08:21:34 PT
compassionate conservatism: taliban and mj
 Who's the Medieval Barbarian? Taliban vs. U.S. There are not too many nice things that can be said about the Taliban....But when it comes to marijuana policy, the Taliban could learn a lesson or two in medieval fundamentalism from the US government and many US states. According to a review of the Taliban penal code by New York Times reporter Amy Waldman, Article 6 of the penal code specifies the following penalty for pot-growing: "A person who cultivates marijuana will be jailed until his family members get rid of the plant."
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Comment #15 posted by qqqq on January 12, 2002 at 03:51:34 PT
Neil Young....?
..I guess once a person is famous and rich for a long enough time,,,things change...
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Comment #14 posted by dddd on January 12, 2002 at 02:18:13 PT
Outstanding Comments!
 Chances of dying in US                                                                   1 in 126 of heart disease
                                                                   1 in 169 of cancer
                                                                   1 in 955 of an accident
                                                                   1 in 2900 of suicide
                                                                   1 in 4100 of Alzheimer's
                                                                   1 in 4500 of AIDS
                                                                   1 in 4700 of murder
                                                                   1 in 14400 of a hernia
                                                                   1 in 74300 of a terrorist attack                                                                    [Center for Disease Control]
Neil Young....what an asshole!
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Comment #13 posted by freedom fighter on January 11, 2002 at 23:57:20 PT
The Problem is
I do'nt recall "terrorists" who blew WTC ever said they were gonna do it to anybody anywhere.As far as I am concerned, evil Bin Laden achieved something that "some" Americans do not want happen in our country. What good it would do if things get better in Afghanistian when it gets worse in good ole America? It does not make sense to me at least when they over there become free while we are not.Oh sure, we will get rid of Bush, excuse me, I hear someone knocking my door..ff
Control Anonymous
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Comment #12 posted by Nuevo Mexican on January 11, 2002 at 23:23:11 PT
Here we go again.......
Please read these articles and tell me you still believe killing women and children is acceptable collatoral damage. If you believe our military, I've got some real estate in Viet Nam to sell you. After you've read some of these stories, come back and defend military action in Afghanistan. How anyone who reads c-news can be pro war, is in a state of denial about what our gov will do to stop people from enjoying their lives, be it sick or healthy, in the name of the war on drugs or the war on terror. Come on fools, defend murder and genocide in all its glory and tell me when you get to heaven that it was the right thing to do. William Pitt: our, 5000 theirs:' kit: everything you need to do! of U.S. collusion real strange coincidence with WTC disaster... Sept. 11th
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Comment #11 posted by FoM on January 11, 2002 at 20:58:36 PT
Just a comment
This is a very interesting thread and I want to thank all of you for making it so. I am for peace and against war but I understand why we are fighting and I accept that as the current course. Sometimes once the ball is rolling it can't be stopped for some time. I think that's where we are now and only time will tell the outcome of all that has been done. Hopefully History will be recorded more accurately because we have the Internet.
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Comment #10 posted by lookinside on January 11, 2002 at 20:32:51 PT:
Sam Adams...
your last paragraph strikes a note with me...I believe that this recent "war" was fought as poorly as is possible and still "win"...kinda like using a daisycutter to stop a burglary...The job could have been done much more cleanly with more intelligence and much less flag waving...this was a war designed to get America behind our current regime; not to actually capture Bin Laden, et al.the body counts are now pretty even..don't we feel much better?EJ: Our older daughter, whom we've raised to be an independent human being, filled us in on the Taliban 2 years ago...We feel as you do about these men...I find it incredible that they found their way to power to begin with...Their demise is the only positive thing to come out of this mess...I just hope that the new government can undo the damage the Taliban did...(I doubt they will...)
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Comment #9 posted by Rainbow on January 11, 2002 at 19:10:44 PT
Where were they
I wonder.
When the OK. bombing happenned Mcveigh et al said it was against the ATF for the WACO thingy. Guess what the ATF were not in the building that they normally would have been in. They were all down the street at a meeting.
I wonder.When the plane came for D.C. What was the target perhaps the White House? Where was Georgy and his wife? They were in a school house in Florida. And reports have them indicating they knew before it happenned what happenned.Once again I wonder.Cheney has been pretty quiet.
I wonder.Yes the US was paid back for SOA, the Israel policies, the lack of support for peace, and our greed for oil. I am afraid that one can predict more of the same. 
remember that a rattle snake only strikes when cornered or threatenned. he will normally slither away. The paletinians have decided not to slither away anymore and I am sure many more are going to be killed. The lebonese have had enough too.I feel bad for those of us who want peace including the men and women of the Middle Eastern nations.Evil begets evil. We have not heard the last of Al Queda, they have been stung and splintered, but their low tech ways will be seen again. I wish people would understand that retaliation and accountability are not always the best way to deal with things. Punishment builds resentment. When there is already a level of resentment it just gets more intense.Pray for Peace
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Comment #8 posted by Sam Adams on January 11, 2002 at 17:40:24 PT
Hey bro, don't think I meant that it's OK to discriminate against Middle Eastern people, or that we should treat the POWs (detainees, whatever the hell they are) unfairly or inhumanely. But I have no respect for anyone who treats another human, especially women, as slaves or chattel. Yes, I am claiming personal moral superiority to Arab men who abuse their women. I don't hate them all, I think many of them are backward-ass, primitive men - it has nothing to do with lack of technology or development or Wal-mart or MTV.There are plenty of Americans who are just as "bad" or worse than the guys locked up in Guantanamo Bay. I don't see an "us vs. them" situation here. Any reduction in the amount of evil being perpetuated by humans against others is a good thing. I'm sorry some civilians got killed off in Afganistan. But you know what? Death happens. No one guaranteed you or anyone else happy life for 80 years. 45,000 American civilians are going to die this year in their cars. Should we shut down the highways?I would be interested in hearing other options for restoring a humane government in Afganistan. From what I hear, many thousands of civilians were massacred there over the years. Now, at least some modicum of order has been restored. Half of the population has been lifted out of bondage. Would you have left them to suffer for years on end as we tried sanctions or other options? How many more massacres would have happened while we wrung our hands? I'm glad we at least finished the job in Afganistan, vs. half-assed in Iraq, a path that lead to 750,000 Kurds being wiped out, and over a million more deaths by starvation. Killing 50,000 civilians to take Bagdad, install a new government, and re-build the country back in 1991 would have made a hell of a lot more sense (oh yeah - Bush again - spineless SOB).Yes, the US govt screwed up in Afganistan - years ago when we bailed after the Russian war to leave them to starve and kill each other for 10 years. I think virtually all Republicans and Democrats are tyrants leading the country and the world down a path of exploitation, dumbing-down, and apathetic subservience. Don't count me among the duped masses, I can't believe that our government that let the WTC bombings occur has been gifted with more power and approval, and the very agencies that screwed up have been given more money! (FBI, etc.). But, IMO, reformers lose credibility when they oppose 100% of everything in the status quo. My major complaint with Afganistan is that we didn't have our ground troops in there to do the dirty work, and as a result, many of the butchers from the Northern Alliance have been installed into positions of power in the new govt. 
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Comment #7 posted by Nuevo Mexican on January 11, 2002 at 16:19:38 PT
Inspired again!
To all peace-loving people here at C-News: Listen to Ledher, Dan B, obsever, dddd, and Fom! They do their research, have common sense, compassion and huge vision!
Hating middle eastern people is no different than them hating you! No one is superior or without faults. OUr 'modern civilized society' is no more advanced than their 13th century mentality. Bush is Osama, Osama is bush!
Can someone explain the difference? While we drop bombs on wedding parties, killing over 100 Afghan people in their sleep, (for something Saudi Arabia supposedly help carry out) how is that different from enslaving women. Same end result: death, disrespect, humiliation and pain, one is slow and one is quick. The difference: how long do we in American feel comfortable torturing people, vs. the level of comfort derived by the religious regimes slooooooow version. Death and deprivation are acheived by both. We are an instant society and prefer quick death and they aren't in any hurry and don't mind torture as their form of entertainment. So far, up to 5000 innocent Afghan civilians and untold numbers of Afghan soliers have died for an oil pipeline to be built through Afghanistan, not because the WTC was destroyed. Look at Enrongate and look who is involved. It is in black and white! This war was planned in advance of 911 and 911 was the trigger to get us into Afghanistan. If you haven't seen the evidence go to and see the many articles documenting the details of this crime. Bush will fall and Americans will pay the price for their leaders decisions. In the name of oil, we will kill women, men and children to drive our SUVS!
And we sit around and talk about how bad those middle eastern men are to their women while we just blow them up and brag about it. Cover it up and pay off the media to shut up and take pictures no one will be allowed to see. Imagine the torture chambers we have set up, only to find out years from now the depth of our governments depravity.
Wake up America! You have been had and you don't even know it! Turn of your tv, get out of your SUV, Ride a bike, play your guitar and meditate on peace! Smoke a joint and realize the biggest lie ever told has been shoved down our throats and imagine the reaction when the people of the good ole USA realize the truth! It will be pretty, as pretty as JFK getting elected and Richard Nixon resigning.
Great things will emerge from this compost heap of an administration and peace will emerge as the new form of life on earth as the age of Pisces(martydom) fall away and the age of equality (Aquarius) explodes into our consciousness. Remember: what good is technology when the men using it are of an unevolved state. It is possibly worse than no technology at all. To believe we are superior to others based on our mode of transportation, microwaving food, genetically altering Gods perfect gifts, and our sophisticated weapons of destruction, is folly. Finally, Womens' rights will be something guaranteed by the UN, not the US. Look at our policy on ourwomen in Saudia Arabia, we force them to were burkha like Sharias, unless they are flying a jet and killing Afghan women and children to bring them the right not to wear sharias! Come on people, this is your government out of control. Get up, Stand up! or should I repeat someones comment here: get pissed off or get 
pissed on! 
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Comment #6 posted by Lehder on January 11, 2002 at 14:15:06 PT
take me away with dan b.
I disagree with John Ashcroft, I will venture to say, on absolutely everything he stands for. I publicly question his sanity and his intelligence and his motives, and condemn him as a traitor. I claim that John Ashcroft has "recused" himself from the Senate's Enron investigation because he has too much dirt on the Bush Crime Family's petroleum machinations, dirt whose revelation would cost Ashcroft and George Bush their jobs at least. I claim that both George Bushes had prior knowledge of the 9/11 attacks, that they permitted them to occur, that they hindered FBI investigations that could have foiled them and that they exploited them for selfish political ends. I claim that the "war on drugs" was designed as a permanent institution for the subversion of democracy.It's my opinion that two George Bushes and one John Ashcroft and many many others should be tried for treason. And the perpetrators of the war on drugs should be tried for the genocidal murders of millions of cancer patients over the last thirty years.There. Although I have only summarized a few of my opinions I think I have said enough to qualify under John Ashcroft's definition as one who is "aiding and abetting terrorism," and, therefore, under George Bush's pronouncements as guilty of terrorism myself. I don't have an airplane or even a fire cracker, but by the proclamations of the ignorant despots who subverted the national and Florida elections of 2000 and their Jesus-freak hirelings and their daily-prayer-meeting-opus-dei pig-dumb lackeys, I am a terrorist and subject to secret trial and execution by military tribunal. That's what they can do to me.What am I going to do? I'm gonna watch. I'm going to observe and comment on the political and economic collapse of the United States. And I'm gonna say, "I told ya so." And when the federal government has completely self-destructed at the cost of the simultaneous and willful destruction of its host society, I'm gonna celebrate a new future in a better world.
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Comment #5 posted by FoM on January 11, 2002 at 13:33:28 PT
This is what I mean
EJ, It really isn't sympathy for them but concern for how we might come to accept how detainees are treated. I watched a program on World Link TV about the School of the Americas from a Catholic Priests eyes and it was horrible. We train people to be butchers. If we aren't concerned about how a detainee is treated we might come to accept bad treatment as normal and what group could be next?
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Comment #4 posted by Sam Adams on January 11, 2002 at 12:55:44 PT
you go EJ
EJ, I didn't know you were female, cool!A friend of mine did a semester abroad in Cairo, Egypt. She had many horrible tales to tell. Being spit on, followed, snickered at, threatened, etc, etc, etc. I think it's important for people to realize what our "allies" over there are like. Basically, medieval. Homosexuality is against the law and can receive the death penalty or prison (btw, no, that doesn't apply to me but I'm still disgusted by it). If there was no oil over there, these people would basically be living in 13nth century Europe.The reasons are so transparent, too. When your whole life sucks and you have nothing, what can you do? Enslave someone else so at least you're not at the bottom of the ladder. Or maybe these guys can't stand the fact that their attraction to a woman's beauty gives the woman some degree of power over them, so they force them to hide because they can't handle it.The male ego at it's worst, I'm afraid. The saddest thing is, some of my buddies exhibit the same tendencies. I have an Irish-Catholic friend who totally thinks the man should be the king of the house, and the woman basically a servant - he's against any abortion rights, against birth control, etc. And the reason is that all his relationships have failed, because he's a control freak. He can't stand the feeling of becoming emotionally invested in someone else because it means he has lost control - his girlfriend has the power to hurt him and he's too weak to handle it. So he hates almost all women for it. (totally against cannabis, I might add - thinks it's disgusting. He's a reformed alcoholic as well, he actually go thrown in jail for causing an accident drunk driving - we all know the type).Most prohibitionists and other repressive types have incredibly low self-esteem - they fear everything and CONTROL is the only answer, they cling to it like a security blanket. 
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Comment #3 posted by E_Johnson on January 11, 2002 at 11:45:47 PT
The problem with an undeclared war
I feel very uneasy how they are handling the Prisoners of War. They call them Detainees.If you're talking about the fighters captured in Afghanistan, I don't think we can legally call them POWs since I don't think Congress ever legally declared war on Afghanistan. The detainees in America can't be called POWs because they were never in a war period. I have no doubt how these Al Qaida war prisoners would handle me if I ended up in their milieu, so it's hard for me to care about that group. These are people who were fighting for the right to obliterate women from society as much as humanly possible without actual literal mass gynocide.They treat women like me with the backs of their ugly stinking hands. A big fat ugly welt on your face is all you're going to get from one of these poor prisoners if you're female.Just imagine how much justice and compassion Saudi women get from these awful hateful freaks.But I don't know if you mean the immigration detainees in America or the captured warriors from Afghanistan. The first group contains probably many innocent people, at least innocent of being terrorists, maybe guilty of staying on expired visas, which is something almost every upper middle class au pair in America is probably guilty of too.(Gee if they ever went after the Irish -- the Irish I think are the biggest visa violators in America, and get away with it because they're white and serve the American upper middle class so well.)I think the second group is getting their karmic reward for the hateful path they've chosen. But since they live in hate, then the hateful conditions of prison probably feel good to them in the sense that it will continue to keep their hatred high stoked up the way they like it.When people get high on hate, they don't want to be treated well. Prison helps them stay hateful. If we really wanted to demoralize the Al Qaida followers, we should send them all to Club Med and get them all hooked on Mai Tais and snorkeling.
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Comment #2 posted by FoM on January 11, 2002 at 10:50:16 PT
A Question
I feel very uneasy how they are handling the Prisoners of War. They call them Detainees. It makes me feel really uncomfortable. They better be letting reporters hang around. I'm afraid what could happen to them. I know some are guilty but some aren't I'm sure. I watched the most remarkable program on World Link TV last night. It was a detailed hour show on the School of The Americas through the eyes of a Catholic Priest. I don't know how many people get World Link TV but it is great! It is really telling us how it is. I would have posted an article about it but they didn't have anything. I get it on Direct TV.
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Comment #1 posted by Dan B on January 11, 2002 at 10:34:28 PT:
Come and get me, coppers!
Dear Feds:I've not only said plenty against the Bush administration, but I have written it down for all to see. In case you missed it, G-Men and G-Women, here it is: I believe that the president, vice president, John Ashcroft, and everyone who voted for the USA PATRIOT Act should be tried for treason. Those who carry out the unconstitutional methods allowed by the USA PATRIOT Act should also be tried for treason. The president should, at the very least, be impeached for all that he has done to undermine the American way of life. That's my opinion, and I have my right to it as an American. If you have a problem with it, sorry, but I won't answer your insulting, insinuating questions just because I have an opinion. I have no intention of ever taking the law into my own hands (why would I stoop to your level?), so you really have no reason to bother with me. There is a difference between an opinion and a threat. What you are doing is investigating opinions, when you should be investigating threats. For the sake of American values, stop corrupting America by making it into a police state. If you are conducting these kinds of investigations, realize that you are the biggest threat America now faces.Sincerely,Dan B
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