cannabisnews.com: Why Legalizing Drugs is Dopey Idea 





Why Legalizing Drugs is Dopey Idea 
Posted by CN Staff on August 10, 2003 at 12:02:50 PT
By Lou Dobbs
Source: New York Daily News 
We've spent hundreds of billions of dollars in law enforcement, prevention and treatment since former President Richard Nixon declared war on drugs in 1971. Yet the use of illicit substances continues to plague our country.The federal government spends nearly $1 billion a month on this war, but users spend more than five times that much to buy drugs.
Beyond the horrific human toll of 20,000 drug-induced deaths each year, illegal drugs cost our economy more than $280 billion annually, according to the Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration.Incredibly, there are those who choose to ignore drugs' human devastation and economic cost. Many of them are pseudo-sophisticate baby boomers who consider themselves superior and hip in their wry, reckless disregard of the facts.They also may smoke marijuana, advocate its legalization and rationalize cocaine as what they call a recreational drug.And there is a surprising list of libertarians and conservatives, including William Buckley and Nobel laureate economist Milton Friedman, who also advocate the legalization of drugs.Another Nobel laureate, Gary Becker, a professor of economics at the University of Chicago, told me, "It would certainly save a lot of resources for society. We could tax drug use so it could even lead to government revenue."Lou Dobbs: loudobbs nydailynews.com  Snipped: Complete Article: http://www.nydailynews.com/business/story/107792p-97441c.htmlSource: New York Daily News (NY)Author: Lou DobbsPublished: August 10, 2003 Copyright: 2003 Daily News, L.P.Contact: voicers edit.nydailynews.comWebsite: http://www.nydailynews.com/CannabisNews -- Justice Archiveshttp://cannabisnews.com/news/list/justice.shtml
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Comment #33 posted by ekim on August 16, 2003 at 20:51:33 PT
thanx Fom and Ab 
but what i really want to do is find out the web site of those two blogers on c-span and ask them what they would blog if they knew the story of my getting ( lost_) 
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Comment #32 posted by afterburner on August 16, 2003 at 19:10:16 PT:
ekim - Consider a Letter to Your MI Rep & Senator
ekim - In Case You're Interested http://www.cannabisnews.com/news/thread16576.shtml#14
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Comment #31 posted by FoM on August 16, 2003 at 17:56:22 PT
ekim
I'm sorry that happened to you. More and more I watch how this is all evolving and sometimes it worries me. The Seattle Hemp Fest is going on now and I've checked the major papers in the Seattle area and not one story. They have an article for another festival but not Hemp Fest.http://www.seattlehempfest.com/
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Comment #30 posted by ekim on August 16, 2003 at 17:01:02 PT
called c-span fri 
the screening has become allmost unbareable --truly un-c-span like. Brian Lamb was the host with two blogers with the site "Shouting across the Potomac" a lib and a con. I was asked by the screener what was my question so i said i wanted to know if they watched cable along with the newspapers for info to blog on. when i did get on i got the part about do you get your info from the cable and did you see Lou Dobbs did a whole week on the drug war at which point i was cut off. Brian said well i guess i lost him. man that burns me up -- the idea that now on c-span you can not even mention a drug poll on a prime time cable show like Lou Dobbs with out being blacklisted ----------- how in the hell did we get this shallow so fast.
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Comment #29 posted by Jose Melendez on August 15, 2003 at 11:59:45 PT
transcript: laughable
(END VIDEOTAPE)
   HOPKINS: Still ahead, the results of our poll. Then, your reaction to our series of special reports on "The Forgotten War," the war on drugs.  
   (COMMERCIAL BREAK) 
   HOPKINS: The preliminary results of our poll question tonight. We asked: "Do you believe that marijuana should be decriminalized?" Ninety-three percent of you said yes. Surprising results.    Turning to stocks, the Nasdaq continued its losing streak today. Blue chips pushed higher. Dow Industrials up 64 points. The Nasdaq losing 8. The S&P up 3.  
   Christine Romans has the market for us -- Christine. 
   CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNNfn CORRESPONDENT: Jan, it was consumer stocks that led the Dow and the S&P higher today. You look at stronger sales for McDonald's in July. That was 20 percent of the Dow's gain. And Caterpillar hit an all-time high today. But as you said, the Nasdaq slipped, and that brought the week's losses for the Nasdaq to more than 4 percent. It was the worst weekly point loss since July of last year.  
   Now, the Nasdaq's been lagging the blue chips the last few weeks. And many say that's because it's outperformed the market so much this year. The Nasdaq gains this year are more than double the S&P 500 and the Dow.  
   Meanwhile, the FDA late today accuse Bristol-Myers of running misleading magazine and newspaper ads for Pravachol. The FDA say the print ads suggest the drug is the only treatment for preventing strokes. It is not. Florida's Medicaid Fraud Unit is the latest agency to investigate Tenet Health Care. This just days after Tenet paid $54 million to settle allegations of unnecessary surgery in California.  
   And, Jan, two big stock losers today. R.J. Reynolds said the SEC is looking into how it accounts for certain costs. And Winn-Dixie down 15 percent today. The grocery store chain said it's feeling the pinch from the economy and troop deployments -- Jan. 
   HOPKINS: Interesting. Thanks. Christine Romans.  
   And now a look at your thoughts.  
   Regarding our story on the growing use of antidepressants among children, Audrey of Louisiana wrote, " I had been on three different antidepressants before I was 16. None helped. Yet my doctor kept pushing them. If anything, they made me more depressed because I felt like I was taking this little pill to give me fake happiness, which is I wanted to live." 
   In response to our series "The Forgotten War," the war on drugs, David in Arizona wrote, "December 16, 1988 was the first day I was free from cocaine, crank and alcohol. Now I have a family, my own business and hope. I could not have done this without treatment." 
   And Thomas in California wrote, "I am a 17-year-old recovering addict and quitting drugs, getting my life back in order was the hardest thing I've ever had to do. The more the issues of addiction and treatment are addressed, the more people can beat this disease." 
   You can e-mail us anytime at loudobbstonight cnn.com (sic)
Transcript: Should Drugs Be Decriminalized?
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Comment #28 posted by afterburner on August 14, 2003 at 08:45:52 PT:
Richard Cowan's Lengthy Response to Lou Dobbs
Lou Dobbs Plays Arthur Andersen to The Drug War’s Enron. A Week of Prohibitionist Propaganda And 91% Of His “Pseudosophisticate” Viewers Still Vote for Decrim. 
Posted by Richard Cowan on August 11, 2003 00:00:00 
Source: 
 
"If someone were to try to sell stocks and bonds using the sort of data presented by Dobbs and his guests, Dobbs would denounce them as crooks and demand that they be prosecuted, and would call for their auditors to be fired and prosecuted. It was both incompetent and dishonest, and offered even more proof that cannabis prohibition is not just a failure but a counterproductive fraud." 
 
Read Full Story...
http://www.marijuananews.com/news.php3?sid=705
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Comment #27 posted by afterburner on August 11, 2003 at 13:44:38 PT:
putative democracy - Kap
AKA punitive democracy. John Ralston Saul, the Canadian legislator, points out in several of his books that illegal weapons are the world's largest business, followed closely by illegal drugs. Maybe the US government is just being honest. Naaah!
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Comment #26 posted by kaptinemo on August 11, 2003 at 13:29:16 PT:
I second FoM' s and Mike's observation
Only a factory manager would reduce human life to the number of 'operations' that could be extracted from a 'wage slave' or (machine voice) "in-dus-tree-ahl yoo-nit!" until they are no longer 'useful'.Dobbs is behaving exactly as his sponors wish: avoid the very obvious (and he's an economist?) problem of what happens at the point of 'diminishing return' when all the effort you put into something produces less of what you want, and more of what you don't. The entire War on Drugs has been a colossal example of that economic law in operation. But in order to maintain his 'connections' to his 'sources', Dobbs engages in sycophancy. And remains silent about the costs to his beloved bean-counting Republican brethren of maintaining a failed war in a putative democracy.Because, what does this 'industry' produce? Its' most tangible 'products' are concrete prisons and jail bars, locks and gates and guns and ammo and ...all kinds of things that capital has been sunk into, BUT RETURN VERY FEW SALABLE GOODS TO THE MARKET. A prison that cages thousands of people may produce license plates and metal lockers, but what else does it provide to the locale? Guard jobs? While the rest of the State crumbles due to lack of funds? It can be argued that for every college or tech vocation center, you get hundreds of skilled workers who have a positive effect upon the community. What 'value' can be placed on maintaining a prison, save for the obvious one of keeping the TRULY dangerous behind bars? How many millions of dollars will it cost to get low-level offenders, whose only crime was to be caught doing what the elite's children have done with impunity, back into society, when no one wants to hire them?Mr. Dobbs is demonstrating the fact that gray hair and a title from a university do not confer wisdom.
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Comment #25 posted by Mike on August 11, 2003 at 12:37:06 PT
It scares me...
When people begin placing quotas on how much "productivity" needs to come out of each citizen.. and how that is even measured....::shudder::I do wonder how our country might fare if prohibition were lifted and all that inflated black market money wasn't flooding the economy anymore... Typically those most outspoken against lifting prohibition have personal financial gain to make by ensuring its continuation.  ::sigh::
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Comment #24 posted by mayan on August 11, 2003 at 03:39:03 PT
Billions 4 Nothing...
The first paragraph speaks volumes. Is it not in itself a case for legalization? "We've spent hundreds of billions of dollars in law enforcement, prevention and treatment since former President Richard Nixon declared war on drugs in 1971. Yet the use of illicit substances continues to plague our country."Morality, or someones version of morality cannot be legislated.Libertarian's lawsuit targets electronic voting machines:
http://www.lp.org/lpnews/0308/votingmachines.htmlHow To Rig An Election In The United States:
http://whatreallyhappened.com/rigvote.html
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Comment #23 posted by FoM on August 10, 2003 at 21:19:30 PT
Special Program on World Link TV
We watched this program it was a real eye opener. Does cable offer World Link TV or do only people with satellites get it? I wonder how many people have access to program that is so interesting.WorldLink Spotlight: Israel's Secret Weapon: http://www.worldlinktv.org/programming/programDescription.php4?code=israel_secret
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Comment #22 posted by goneposthole on August 10, 2003 at 21:01:39 PT
Schutzstaffel and Stasi combined
Schutzstaffel, S.S., SS., SS n.
  "protective rank, defense corps": the personal bodyguard of Adolf Hitler; later, the Elite Guard of the Nazi militia, the Black Shirts. See also Waffen SS. See further examples under Gestapo and Kommandant.Stasi n.
  the internal security force or secret police of the former German Democratic Republic (East Germany) [short for German Staatssicherheitspolizei or -dienst "State security police or service" * "They're the perpetrators of the Stasi secret police—who like the Nazis before them feel no remorse." Stefan Thiel, "Old Stasi Never Die", Newsweek, Dec. 10, 2001, p. 39.http://germanenglishwords.com/rlgs.htm Old DEA never die, too. They're doped up on power and horrificly abuse their fellow man. Brainwashed by propaganda is the problem. It is de facto governmental 'malpractice'.  Legal information on medical mistakes & malpracticeA 1999 study by the Institute of Medicine, which is part of the National Academy of Sciences, estimated 44,000 to 98,000 hospital patients in the U.S. die each year from medical malpractice. That's 268 deaths per day. This far exceeds the number of people killed in traffic accidents per year (43,450), or those who die yearly from breast cancer (42,300) or AIDS (16,400). In addition to death, medical mistakes can cause birth trauma, brain injury, paralysis, amputation, disability, and disfigurement. horrific, is it not?http://www.edgarsnyder.com/injured/medical/
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Comment #21 posted by JHarshaw on August 10, 2003 at 20:24:33 PT
re: comment 19
As I sit here and watch the world changing around me the thought has struck me that maybe the Soviet Union fell because the Communists didn't need it any more.Just a thought.peace and pot
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Comment #20 posted by FoM on August 10, 2003 at 20:16:01 PT
i420
I believe what happened to your friend. I really do.JR, I haven't heard anything about how it went today for Marc Emery. 
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Comment #19 posted by Petard on August 10, 2003 at 19:48:45 PT
i420 Not "treatment center"
The real name would be "re-education camp". Since we have adopted the old Soviet "Czar" and we now have "Gulags" (prisons) with more people in them than old Soviet Russia ever did, and most are indeed political prisoners (MJ users). Basically we didn't win the Cold War, we BECAME the USSA (United Soviet States of America) and we're losing remaining freedoms to the "terrorists" too (the ones in D.C.). We have Communism in a different and radical way, the people own nothing as the government can at any time take everything anyone has in their immediate possession, sell it at auction and keep the money to put back into their closed system. And as the recent article indicated, the government doesn't even attempt to clean-up or out any "contraband" allowing them to re-seize and resell again and again. The ruling elite have it all and only allow the worker class an illusion of ownership. 
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Comment #18 posted by JR Bob Dobbs on August 10, 2003 at 19:33:52 PT
Marc Emery Edmonton news?
Anyone know anything about Marc's appearance in Edmonton? Here's an article from the morning paper, but I'd like to know how the event went...
http://www.canoe.ca/EdmontonNews/es.es-08-10-0016.html
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Comment #17 posted by i420 on August 10, 2003 at 19:19:45 PT
Got that right FoM
Are we a free people or are we only free if we fall in line and believe what people tells us and do what we're told and never question?You got that right FoM... I just found out a friend of mine was kicked out of the Northeastern Center which was a court order "treatment" for possession. He was kicked out for pointing out the truth when they were lying to the class about marijuana, for example they told the class marijuana and alcohol gives people the same intoxicating effect. He pointed out that it did not and gave examples they said he was a "bad" influence on the class.
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Comment #16 posted by afterburner on August 10, 2003 at 19:13:59 PT:
That's What We Call in Canada Small-c conservative
Since we have a Conservative Party and a Liberal Party, we use small-c conservative and small-l liberal to describe lifestyles and ways of thinking as opposed to political affiliations.ego transcendence follows ego destruction, apparently the police are now making up their own laws, implying that toking in public is illegal but toking in private is legal in Ontario: legal is legal; anti-smoking legislation has driven smokers into the streets; who cares what they're smoking as long as it's a legal "product" like tobacco or cannabis.
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Comment #15 posted by FoM on August 10, 2003 at 18:52:18 PT
Conservative
I used the word conservative and I thought that might be looked at as a political way of thinking. I didn't mean that but meant for the word to mean not spending money because buying lots of things isn't really important. That's what I meant by conservative. 
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Comment #14 posted by FoM on August 10, 2003 at 18:36:56 PT
Just a Comment
I don't understand why Lou Dobbs did this article and finished up with a very bad and slanted final show on tv last week. He didn't even have anyone to show our side when John Walters was on. What keeps going thru my mind is they think that Cannabis consumers aren't productive. What really is productive and by whose standards? I mean that too. Isn't finding time to be good parents and be conservative and save money a good thing? Isn't that wise? Is it wrong to be content with what we have and find calmness in the midst of chaos? Are we only worker bees or are we allow to chart our own course in life? Are we a free people or are we only free if we fall in line and believe what people tells us and do what we're told and never question?
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Comment #13 posted by AlvinCool on August 10, 2003 at 18:18:27 PT
Study
So let me get this straight. The way I see it this guy wants the real truth. So that means that Lou, and all other prohibitionists, should rally behind allowing all medical schools in the US to participate using students to perform the work under teachers supervision? To show they have been right all this time and put this old legalization stuff to rest.Wonder how many would come back positive?
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Comment #12 posted by afterburner on August 10, 2003 at 15:55:28 PT:
In Case It Hasn't Been Posted Yet [Marc Emery]
CN AB: Pot Activist Tests Police On Drug Law 10 Aug 2003 
The Calgary Sun 
http://www.mapinc.org/newscc/v03/n1203/a06.html?397
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Comment #11 posted by i420 on August 10, 2003 at 15:13:23 PT
Not trying to brag but..
Drug users cost the country $160 billion each year in lost productivity. Everynight at work I run not one but THREE or FOUR machines simultaneously that NOONE else in my plant wants to operate. In addition I run anywhere from 100% to 120% rate. So far this year I have not missed one day other than my vacation days. Before this year since they upped our attendance bonus I would use my points for extra days off, we were working so much overtime missing those days didn't matter. They gave us the point system many people take advantage of it because it's there.
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Comment #10 posted by Virgil on August 10, 2003 at 15:12:29 PT
Wrong
The federal government spends nearly $1 billion a month on this war, but users spend more than five times that much to buy drugs.$20 billion a year would be more accurate than $12. Here is the drug war clock- http://www.drugsense.org/wodclock.htm 
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Comment #9 posted by prop203 on August 10, 2003 at 15:04:39 PT
SCREAM
Drug users cost the country $160 billion each year in lost productivity. EVERY SINGLE TIME!!!I have been debating on IRC and everytime I debate someone about pot.. it alwase comes down to well "it makes you lazy" Lazyness is no reason to make a law that jails people!This is america DO i not have a right to be lazy? And wasnt the opiates that fueld SAN FRANS china town 80-100 hour work weeks in the early 1900's?Anyways who cares about other drugs! I refuse to think of pot as a drug.. especially if thier going to leave out alcholol and tabacoProp203
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Comment #8 posted by i420 on August 10, 2003 at 14:47:33 PT
Make reading fun!!
As you are reading this garbage picture Jaba the Hut on his throne.
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Comment #7 posted by FoM on August 10, 2003 at 14:11:58 PT
How Old is Lou Dobbs?
I've been looking to try to find out how old he is and can't find his age. 
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Comment #6 posted by freedom fighter on August 10, 2003 at 14:02:36 PT
Actually lombar
We can by lookin at the percentage of people who entered hospitials... Interesting thing about the percentage of "addicts" is that before the prohibition, 1.8% of the population were addicts and today, under the prohibition, it is still at 1.8% I got that info from Judge Kane?Lou is a pseduo-neo-con-facist-pig!93% Hey Johnny! 93% says otherwise.....pazff
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Comment #5 posted by lombar on August 10, 2003 at 13:42:36 PT
More of the same misdirection
"And drugs are involved in seven out of 10 cases of abuse and neglect."And how many of the 7 cases are due not to the drugs themselves but because the parent(s) is being imprisioned for using a drug??? Did they count alcohol as a drug for this statistic?"Drugs did not become viewed as bad because they are illegal," Wilson said. "Rather, they became illegal because they are clearly bad."Blatant falsehood. They became illegal for racist reasons. Alcohol is clearly bad, tobacco is clearly bad, yet these users do not face long-term incarceration for their hedonistic indulgences.(using depleted uranium for weapons is clearly bad, leaving landmines strewn about the countryside is clearly bad, burning more fossil fuels is clearly bad, lying to go to war is clearly bad, .....)"John Walters, national drug control policy director, is optimistic about the war on drugs. 
(Because he has thru his efforts guaranteed another 600k+ domestic victims of the drug war and a cushy high paying job for another puritan... )Walters told me, "We have to remember that, since we got serious in the '80s, overall drug use is half of what it was. And that's progress."How do you make this measurement? Usage rates in the 80's and now are still unknown and will not be known under prohibition, they don't know how much drugs enter the country so how can he make this claim? 
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Comment #4 posted by afterburner on August 10, 2003 at 13:26:57 PT:
Lou Dobbs Wrote this Crap?
Shame on him!
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Comment #3 posted by Arthropod on August 10, 2003 at 12:55:11 PT:
A sad state of affairs
I never thought I'd see the day when someone used libertarian as a dirty word.
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Comment #2 posted by i420 on August 10, 2003 at 12:49:46 PT
Thanks Louii
Beyond the horrific human toll of 20,000 drug-induced deaths each year, illegal drugs cost our economy more than $280 billion annually, according to the Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration.The deaths are a result of an unregulated market and trigger happy cops. These deaths are clearly avoidable.Drug users cost the country $160 billion each year in lost productivity. This is just propaganda to turn business owners against use the truth is we work harder than the rest to overcome the stigma.John Walters, national drug control policy director, is optimistic about the war on drugs. Walters told me, "We have to remember that, since we got serious in the '80s, overall drug use is half of what it was. And that's progress."Since they have gotten serious users have gone into the closet to save their butts...thats why the homosexuals have come out of the closet there wasn't room for us all.
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Comment #1 posted by Arthropod on August 10, 2003 at 12:48:15 PT:
Lou
I wonder if old Lou drinks at all? I know its old news, but take the word "drugs" out and replace it with alcohol in every instance it occurs in this article.
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