Cannabis News The November Coalition
  County Joins Pot-Fighting Lawsuit
Posted by CN Staff on August 26, 2006 at 08:52:50 PT
By Chris Collins  
Source: Merced Sun-Star 

medical California -- Merced County is gearing up for a smoking showdown with civil rights groups that could determine the future of state medical marijuana laws. The county is expected to file legal papers on Friday that will join San Diego and San Bernardino counties in arguing that federal laws banning marijuana supersede any state laws allowing the use of the drug.

The Merced County Counsel's Office joined the legal battle three months ago in an effort to overturn Proposition 215, the 1996 measure that allows Californians to use marijuana for medicinal purposes.

But most members of the county Board of Supervisors say they want the marijuana laws clarified, but don't want to see the drug completely banned.

They were hard-pressed to explain why they all voted to join a lawsuit that would prohibit any marijuana use, even for medicinal purposes.

"I don't know," said Supervisor Kathleen Crookham. "I would assume we're involved because so many people raised the issue."

Supervisor Jerry O'Banion said he didn't think the county was taking a stance on the issue.

"I don't look at it as we're siding on someone's side," he said.

But Merced County's attorneys argue in a complaint filed in San Diego Superior Court that Proposition 215 "is invalid as a matter of law."

Supervisor Mike Nelson, who is the only member of the board who said he is opposed to the use of medical marijuana, said the supervisors voted to join the lawsuit after Merced resident Grant Wilson repeatedly showed up to board meetings earlier this year.

At each meeting, Wilson asked supervisors to vote on whether the county should issue identification cards for people who were prescribed medical marijuana, as ordered by the Legislature in 2003.

Merced County and most other California counties have not set up an identification system yet, saying it would cause too much confusion for health and law enforcement officials.

Nelson, who is the chairman of the board, denied Wilson's requests each time. Instead, Nelson voted to join the lawsuit.

"Mr. Wilson has continually come asking for some determination," he said. "So to help him along, we're asking for a determination."

The lawsuit would have gone on without Merced County's participation however, and the court would have eventually reached a ruling that would clarify which marijuana laws should prevail.

Asked if the county could have waited for the lawsuit to play out instead of devoting staff time to the effort, Nelson replied, "Perhaps."

Wilson could not be reached for comment Friday. In a letter he sent to Nelson in July, he said he felt "misled and deceived" by the board's decision to join the lawsuit.

Supervisor Deidre Kelsey, who said she supports the right for patients to be prescribed marijuana, said she voted for the county to join the lawsuit that would eliminate that right because the county's participation would give local officials some say in how the legal battle is resolved if the case is settled.

"It gives us an opportunity to give our input at the table if there's an opportunity for negotiations," Kelsey said.

Supervisor John Pedrozo could not be reached for comment Friday.

Deputy Counsel Walter Wall, who is assigned to argue against Proposition 215 for Merced County, provided basic details about the marijuana lawsuit, but declined to comment on why the county decided to join the legal effort.

San Diego County supervisors voted 3-2 last November to file suit against the state to overturn Proposition 215. The lawsuit also seeks to eliminate the 2003 law passed by the Legislature that requires identification cards for marijuana users.

San Bernardino County joined the legal battle in January and Merced County jumped in five months later. No other counties have joined the lawsuit.

The counties' opposition has mounted in recent weeks. A judge ruled Aug. 5 that the American Civil Liberties Union, the Drug Policy Alliance and Americans for Safe Access could join the fight against the three counties.

Another group, called Safe Access Now, rallied marijuana-rights supporters in Merced County in May after supervisors voted to join the lawsuit.

A half dozen locals and Aaron Smith, a Safe Access Now lobbyist, called on county officials to drop the legal effort because they said other courts have already backed the legality of Proposition 215.

"It would be a great misappropriation of Merced County's limited resources to entangle itself in this costly lawsuit," Smith said in a statement released at that time.

Note: Taking a stance against medical marijuana.

Source: Merced Sun-Star (CA)
Author: Chris Collins
Published: August 26, 2006
Copyright: 2006 Merced Sun-Star
Contact: editor@mercedsun-star.com
Website: http://www.mercedsun-star.com/

Related Articles & Web Sites:

ACLU
http://www.aclu/org/

Drug Policy Alliance
http://www.drugpolicy.org/

Americans For Safe Access
http://www.safeaccessnow.org/

Ruling Lets ACLU, Others Join Suit
http://cannabisnews.com/news/thread22044.shtml

Patients Get OK To Oppose MMJ Challenge
http://cannabisnews.com/news/thread22040.shtml

Get The Pot To The Patients
http://cannabisnews.com/news/thread22020.shtml


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Comment #58 posted by FoM on August 27, 2006 at 13:13:36 PT
whig
I don't have anything to do with how they store CNews. I actually wouldn't understand if someone told me. Matt takes care of that type thing.

[ Post Comment ]
 
Comment #57 posted by FoM on August 27, 2006 at 13:12:01 PT
Museman
I'm listening to it now. Really good stuff there fella!

[ Post Comment ]
 
Comment #56 posted by museman on August 27, 2006 at 13:03:53 PT
marshian follow-up
and for a couple of folks here at Cnews - you know who you are ;-}

[ Post Comment ]
 
Comment #55 posted by whig on August 27, 2006 at 10:10:43 PT
FoM
The cost of disk storage is so incredible cheap compared to the cost of bandwidth.

[ Post Comment ]
 
Comment #54 posted by FoM on August 27, 2006 at 06:44:52 PT
Dankhank
I know we have been down sized because of space so maybe that's why it cut it off. I remember when Ron Bennett made CNews he did say there wasn't a limit on the amount of comments. I think long posts are very interesting to read as well as smaller comments. I really believe it is just to save space. They have a lot of web sites they maintain so that's probably why.

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Comment #53 posted by Dankhank on August 27, 2006 at 06:16:04 PT
423
Some of the individual post are quite long ...

If all the posts were of uniform size, 'bout a paragraph, it may be possible to have more posts.

the folder, whatever may be limited by bit or byte size ..

Rained here last night, this morning is cool, damp and beautiful.

Peace to all this fine morning.

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #52 posted by Sinsemilla Jones on August 26, 2006 at 20:14:37 PT
whig - I guess some of my last post is to you, too
I'm so very slooooow at expressing my thoughts via the keyboard, and I tend to over edit. By the time I make a post, there always so much more that has been posted, that I'm always way behind.

But anyways, before I take too much time -

"All revealed religions are true, all are false, depending on how you take them."

Yeah, that.

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #51 posted by Sinsemilla Jones on August 26, 2006 at 20:05:20 PT
Muse - Both and both
Actually, I was originally refering to the webmaster/programmer who set the post limit at 423, but realized it could apply to the poster and the post of that number as well, so I decided not to differentiate.

And you don't have to be a Discordian to be a discordian, just like you don't have to be a Christian to be Christ like. In fact, as the rule of irony seems to dictate, it probably helps the latters not to be the formers, but is not neccessarily exclusive. I also saw your comment on the virtue of dissent.

As far as the truism, sometimes I get lucky and don't entirely fuck up the inspiration.

You're pretty good at that, too, as are several others around here.

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Comment #50 posted by Hope on August 26, 2006 at 19:51:51 PT
You're doing a good job and you aren't
being rude.

We all, I think, are supposed to think of ourselves as "the least of these"...His brethren. And people like Brother Marsh can also be "the least of these".

No good seeing the Lord and having to say, "When did we call you an idiot, Lord?"

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Comment #49 posted by whig on August 26, 2006 at 19:51:06 PT
Sinsemilla Jones
I tried Eris for a bit, before I figured my way out. Didn't work as a useful metaphor. The problem is fundamentally, if you treat God as Eris (and I consider all aspects to be God, whatever name the particular face and approach), Eris is untrustworthy. Perhaps it could be said to have been an aspect of myself, when I promise more than I can deliver. But it was not as fruitful a metaphor for me as the Christian resurrection. Words cannot fully describe, what is meant has to be experienced. I believe that the Discordian (POEE) texts are inspired, and provide a path for the skeptical, and it was a path that helped me very much. All revealed religions are true, all are false, depending on how you take them.

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Comment #48 posted by Hope on August 26, 2006 at 19:47:40 PT
Whig... you're making me think of David's
famous "Mighty Men" in the Old Testament.

Good job. You've got so much of the written word written on your heart.

You're doing a very good job of telling about the "Good News".

I agree...we will all see Him. I also believe you are right on about believers being the first fruits.

Rev. 1:7 Look, he is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, even those who pierced him; and all the peoples of the earth will mourn because of him. So shall it be! Amen.

James 1:18He chose to give us birth through the word of truth, that we might be a kind of firstfruits of all he created.

When someone throws a verse at you....read the whole chapter at least. Read, study what comes before it and comes after it.

And like Paul told Timothy...Don't let anyone put you down because you're young.

Faith is always tested and tried. It makes you strong and sharp. Testing and honeing is part of it.

I don't like it when people try to "scare" people to God.

"We love him...because he first loved us."

That IS the Apostle Paul writing to Timothy in I Timothy.

http://marshianchronicles.com/?p=698#comments

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #47 posted by museman on August 26, 2006 at 18:56:43 PT
Sinse
Had to be synchronicity.

It's been a long time since I heard the word 'discordian.' I must clear it up that while I have heard it proclaimed 'Hail Discordia' I was never a fraternal brother of such, nor essentially in agreement with that point of view.

"You don't have to find the truth, you just have to look for it." Out of context I could find issue-in the inference that actually 'finding' the truth is a mere bauble on the chain of the action of finding it.

However;

"In fact, if in finding it, you quit seeking it, you've probably lost it." is a truism.



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Comment #46 posted by Sinsemilla Jones on August 26, 2006 at 18:02:55 PT
423
I smell a discordian pothead.

Or synchronicity. They're both holy to me.

By synchronic chance, there's a 423 on the side of a box I see everytime I sit on my toilet.

I think the true words of the one to whom most of the world probably uses the semantic that phonetically sounds like HeyZeus, might survive due to the work of discordians in the system taking advantage of the ignorance of the powers that be.

The system sucks by its very nature, of course, be it religious, educational, or whatever. But fortunately I have had both preachers and teachers in that system, discordians though they might never have even heard the word, who didn't just give me answers, but taught me to ask questions.

"Seek ye the truth, and the truth shall set you free", of course, is the whole of HeyZeus' statement, as most know it. You don't have to find the truth, you just have to look for it. In fact, if in finding it, you quit seeking it, you've probably lost it.



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Comment #45 posted by museman on August 26, 2006 at 17:29:11 PT
whig- RE:the 'pastor'
Kibbitz I will.

"People far wiser than both of us combined have understood and taught this for two thousand years plus."

And I am sure that they all rank quite highly in secular history. I am sure that all those 'wise' sons and daughters of the various royalty in Europe left over after Rome fell- who made up the inquisitions, and conventions which created both 'The Bible' and the 'Doctrine' were well educated (if about 3rd-grade skill-level is 'educated') but I doubt quite seriously if that really qualifies as "wisdom." I am sure that it is easier to believe in the dark ignorance of the middle ages -the bible was officially created in the 1100's shortly before the height of the Crusades, which in turn broguht about such misery and destruction the repercussions still haunt us in modern times- than to excite and challenge ones own intellect in the search for answers.

If that is 'wisdom' it is easy to see why the wool continues to be pulled over the eyes of the spiritually ignorant and lazy.

"...Did you know Christ taught more about Hell than anyone else in the Bible?"

I noticed there was no convenient reference to actual scriptures here. Probably because there isn't any!

"As Jesus said, “No man comes to Father except through Me.” "

Now here is where 'deep thinking' as FoM would put it comes into play.

There are many interpretations or semantical renderings of this line...whole denominations and sects have broken away from the 'mother church' because of that one.

The original translation actually goes like this;

"I am the Alpha and Omega, the Truth, the Light, and The Way. None comes to the Father except BY (with, beside, as my friend, brother and equal) me."

He is a Paulist. According to him we are all " in a world of hurt" (an old military phrase - speaks volumes in itself). The compassion, forgiveness, and Love as actually lived and somewhat accurately described in the various gospels INCLUDING the Gospel of Thomas, the Gospel of Peter, and the incredible 'Dialogue of the Savior' which this 'pastor' probably judiciously avoided in his '30 years of study, is not exemplified in such a statement.

His is a 'faith' based on fear and punishment, an 'old testament' perspective. The vague references where he uses 'jesus' as a source, are actually sourced in doctrine, not gospel.

"If you really believe what you said you do, then according to God’s infallible Word, you are believing in vain."

"Gods infallible word?" Just who was it that determined that? Don't tell me it was Y'shua because then I would have to warn that "...many things can be forgiven, but blasphemey of the Holy Spirit.." is not one of them.

NO of course it was the church. And the Roman Catholic Church at that!

This man really needs to be illuminated. Good luck whig.

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #44 posted by FoM on August 26, 2006 at 17:17:43 PT
museman
Thank you. I really do live in my own little world. I spent so much time in my life trying to figure everything out that I have come to a point where I just have to live by faith. It's peaceful here for me now in my own little world.

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Comment #43 posted by whig on August 26, 2006 at 17:04:09 PT
Another interesting Blog
http://tinyurl.com/l45uf

I haven't read this whole discussion carefully enough, but Chris Bennett participated in the comments.

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #42 posted by museman on August 26, 2006 at 16:54:32 PT
Fom
You see? Of course that is exactly at the core of it.

It's the infinite number of unique ways that we both collectively, and as individuals can embody 'God on Earth' just as Y'shua did, and probably Buddha as well. None of us is qualified to judge, condemn, or even know the hearts and lives of those we think we know, let alone the ones we know very little of, like our 'neighbors.'

We must someday soon come to some fundamental agreements on a racial level, like tolerance of each other's differences.

Love is it's own reward, motivation, and parameter of behavior. There are aspects of the human mind -perhaps it's a male thing but-I'm-not-so-sure, having to do with understanding that requires mental focus, a stringing together of coherent thought which paints a mind picture we know as 'logic' or 'reason.' That is at the core of all philosophy (love of knowledge and truth). Not everyone is a philosopher -except in Athens- and there is enough creation and varied experience available (unless we destroy it) to allow for not being 'philosophical' as well.

It's not a 'good-bad' thing, it's just something to be.

So is the incredible job of moderating Cnews, which you do so well, the word 'greatly' comes to mind.

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #41 posted by FoM on August 26, 2006 at 16:47:28 PT
whig
Now you made me laugh. My favorite word was Why too! LOL! I drove everyone half crazy.

[ Post Comment ]
 
Comment #40 posted by whig on August 26, 2006 at 16:45:56 PT
Or actually...
Right?

I would make really definite statements. Then I would say, Right?

It was something my parents thought was funny.

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #39 posted by whig on August 26, 2006 at 16:45:03 PT
FoM
I never stopped talking when I was a little child, either. :)

My favorite word was always Why?

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #38 posted by whig on August 26, 2006 at 16:43:24 PT
museman
http://marshianchronicles.com/?p=698#comments

Please don't everyone pile on. I think the one-on-one is good for now as long as he'll let me continue. And I will continue for the sake of expressing our differences for myself and everyone who reads his board, not just for him.

If you want to kibbitz here he can't be offended, though.

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Comment #37 posted by whig on August 26, 2006 at 16:39:29 PT
museman #8
He's still talking with me on his board.

[ Post Comment ]
 
Comment #36 posted by FoM on August 26, 2006 at 16:32:23 PT
museman
I guess one of the things I believe is trying to be as a little child. Does that make sense? Basically having faith and I shouldn't be worried just like a child wouldn't worry.

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Comment #35 posted by museman on August 26, 2006 at 16:16:01 PT
FoM
I admire those who can believe, and have faith without 'thinking too deeply'.

We are in agreement, and it is only terminology -semantic interpretation in which we perhaps differ. The English language is the only one I learned, so I endeavored to learn it well, but not necessarily in the 'traditional' fashion.

The agreement we have is this; If we put our faith and trust in the Highest Aspects of being, and follow the path and responsibility of Love, then the idea of 'sin' just doesn't enter into the picture - unless ignorant people -like self assuming xtian priests force the issue.

I am a stickler for what I percieve to be 'correct' interpretation of scriptural meaning, particularly when the price I have paid for the knowledge is literally my life.

When the interpretation cannot be logicly addressed, or illuminated with understanding, and confirmed by experience I for one cannot swallow it.

Therefore when my brethren (brother and sisterhood) and I get caught up in the various nuances of interpretation, such as fervent disagreement on how many angels can fit on the head of a pin, it is time to remember the agreements and put the semantics aside.



[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #34 posted by whig on August 26, 2006 at 15:48:52 PT
museman
Those who aren't with us, are against us, according to the Anti-Christ.

[ Post Comment ]
 
Comment #33 posted by FoM on August 26, 2006 at 15:22:52 PT
museman
I don't think as deeply as you do. I like to believe that the fruits of the spirit if practiced would make us happier and also maybe the world too. I don't analyze scripture but look for what might help me personally.

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Comment #32 posted by museman on August 26, 2006 at 15:08:38 PT
FoM
In my understanding and experience, that sounds more like an overzealous Saul of Tarsus (Paul), than "The Gospel Of Truth."

I don't subscribe to Paul.

In fact I have always considered his Roman nature and heritage as a bit suspect. There are some wonderful ideas and interpretations of Y'shua by Paul, like the epistle to the Hebrews, but the fact that the teachings of Paul form the basis for a lot of what became Roman Catholic Doctrine makes me wonder sometimes just whose side he was really on.

In my mind, if we are not to judge, then where does this definition of sin by which we may condemn each other really come from?

I notice that two important personal liberties are claimed in the 'don't' section;

'Fornication' and 'dissention.'

It's a sure bet that at the heart of it is fear, and not faith. Those words were written for the purposes of instilling fear, and then controlling the people with it. And of course if you happen to be so bold as to disagree, well you are a 'dissenter' therefore a 'sinner' and subject to the persecution and prosecution of the Church and/or State, depending on the era.

One of the most profound things that Y'shua is quoted as saying (and there are many) is, when his disciples had been out attempting to do the work of healing, teaching, and casting out of 'devils', and they had found that there were some-who were not known to the disciples-who were out there healing the sick, making the lame walk, and casting out 'in Y'shuas' 'name''

The disiples were troubled by this and asked Y'shua what they should do.

His answer was this; "If they are not against me, then they are for me."

Can you think of a recent joker who epitomized the reverse psychology of the church in perverting this wonderful statement of freedom and open-endedness into a finite, twisted rendering of falsehood which sounds like truth, but isn't?

I'll give you a clue,

he looks like a monkey and acts like one too.

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #31 posted by FoM on August 26, 2006 at 14:22:34 PT
Museman, This is What I Meant
These are the works any Christian can do, led by the Flesh: (Gal.5:19-21):

Now the works of the flesh are plain: - fornication, - impurity, - licentiousness, - idolatry, - sorcery, - enmity, - strife, - jealousy, -anger, - selfishness, - dissension, - party spirit, - envy, - drunkenness, - carousing, and the like.

I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. These are the Fruits of any Christian led by the spirit, with faith in Christ every second of life: (Gal.5:22-23):

But the fruit of the Spirit is - love, - joy, - peace, - patience, - kindness, - goodness, - faithfulness, - gentleness, - self-control; against such there is no law.

I personally believe if you try to live by the fruits of the spirit you won't do the other.

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #30 posted by museman on August 26, 2006 at 14:09:01 PT
Fom
"museman, yes the fruits of the spirit versus the fruits of the flesh. That's what I believe."

I know to what you refer, as in "Man cannot serve two masters." or "Man cannot worship both 'God' and 'mammon.'

However I take some exception to the use of the term 'the flesh' because of the fear-based false morality asociated with it in Judeo-xtian terminology. It's connotations of 'original sin' and 'born in sin' and 'inherent corruption' are all part of the misdirection that I find so abhorent in the churches and religions. It is also the basis on which these foolish xtians justify their moral ineptitude, and causes them to enter into the accusation and judgement that we are told to avoid.

The 'flesh' is our temporal Temple, the place in which our being resides, where we get the most important aspects of reality brought home to our consiousness through the experiences we have while in it.

True, the material is flawed, and finite, because of entropy and death (which are conditions we still subconsciously agree to thanks to such things as false religious thinking) and seemingly 'doomed' at birth. Yes the matrix into which our divine DNA is cast is of a 'dirt' nature, however we make of it what we will, and the eternal source of our being (as partially discovered in our DNA) is not 'made corrupt' just by the fact of the 'doomed' material with which we are constructed.

I am going to go out on a limb here, and state something that most mystics, shaman, and kabalists understand;

The Spirit of Man, of Adam - sometimes referred to as the Admon-Kadmon is not 'limited' by the 'garment' it wears, but by the choices made while wearing it.

Y'shua said. "It's not what goes into your mouth that condemns you, but what comes out of it."

The fault lies not in the 'flesh' but in the mind/s that inhabit it.

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #29 posted by FoM on August 26, 2006 at 13:58:18 PT
museman
I have always believe that there is no reason for war. One of the first things I thought when 9/11 happened was why did they hate us so much to do this to us. Why were they happy it happened? There was a lot of singing and dancing in the streets when the buildings went down. Instead of getting angry I wanted to know why. It didn't take me long to realize why they hate us. We have supplied Israel with powerful weapons and those weapons kill their families. They hate us because we have totally acted like we hate them.

[ Post Comment ]
 
Comment #28 posted by museman on August 26, 2006 at 13:50:33 PT
FoM
...and the truth DOES scare them.

Death is a very efficient servant that removes dissention quickly and cheaply. They use it, and the fear of it quite profitably to gain their ends of power and control. They use it to erase the evidence in every generation. War is an invention that accomplishes much in their agenda. Thats why 'they' always win, and humanity in general alway loses even if you 'win' the war.

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #27 posted by FoM on August 26, 2006 at 13:44:47 PT
Fruits
museman, yes the fruits of the spirit versus the fruits of the flesh. That's what I believe.

[ Post Comment ]
 
Comment #26 posted by museman on August 26, 2006 at 13:41:41 PT
FoM
Yes, kind of. But one must know the difference between SAYING "God is on our side" and actually HAVING YHWH, YSHWH, and a plethora of ancient good spirit backing you up.

Y'shua said; "You will know them by their fruit." speaking of both friend and foe.

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #25 posted by Dankhank on August 26, 2006 at 13:14:50 PT
Coming on soon SCINE Dish channel 353
What the bleep do we know ...?

http://www.whatthebleep.com/



[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #24 posted by The GCW on August 26, 2006 at 13:11:29 PT
Help
CN NS: Health Canada Cuts Off Sick Man's Pot Supply

http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v06/n1125/a08.html?397

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #23 posted by global_warming on August 26, 2006 at 13:05:21 PT
Why Else
They do not want us to know the kind of power that we have inherent within us. Why else would so much effort over thousands and thousands of years have been made to 'establish' and perpetuate the power elite, while striving mightily to reinforce the general ignorance?

Why is the United States spending millions of our American Tax Dollars, why is our good Government taxing the good citizens, in a war on Cannabis?



[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #22 posted by FoM on August 26, 2006 at 12:53:34 PT
museman
I take what you're saying is if God be for us who can be against us. That could really scare them.

[ Post Comment ]
 
Comment #21 posted by global_warming on August 26, 2006 at 12:50:58 PT
re: DEAd get covers pulled in Chicago
Is this not the same old prohibitions lead line?

Fear and Destruction if you touch this thing, that thing is your soul, if you are having trouble understanding your soul, you are not alone, your soul is a part of the world, the stars and Eternity is your playground, forever.



[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #20 posted by museman on August 26, 2006 at 12:48:13 PT
FoM#14
"If you don't like the laws change them. That's how a democracy works. Everytime we do it the way they said they turn around and fight us. What's that? When can we win in anything we do if it is against the powers that be?"

It's 'their' game, and the only way to get on the board is to serve something other than what your natural intuitive being KNOWS IS WRONG!

When the 'Archangel Michael was wrestling with Satan, Satan hurled all manner of accusation at him. Michael said "May YHWH rebuke you." for he dared not enter into accusation.'

When you 'play their game' you have already lost that which you originally sought in the first place.

They do not want us to know the kind of power that we have inherent within us. Why else would so much effort over thousands and thousands of years have been made to 'establish' and perpetuate the power elite, while striving mightily to reinforce the general ignorance?

The solution is in us, it lacks only our collective faith and belief to become real.

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #19 posted by FoM on August 26, 2006 at 12:33:56 PT
hempity
I don't mind you posting it. I'm confused about stop the drug war you mentioned. Aren't they on our side?

[ Post Comment ]
 
Comment #18 posted by global_warming on August 26, 2006 at 12:32:14 PT
re boldness
"be bold enough to proclaim it"

Proclaim it until the stars stop twinkling



[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #17 posted by hempity on August 26, 2006 at 12:29:54 PT
DEAd get covers pulled in Chicago
FoM I really wanted you to see this, it is being removed from sites like stopthedrugwar.com and the washington post as we speak. Guess the DEAd guys don't like having their covers pulled.

DEA Exhibit Linking Drugs and Terrorism Criticized August 14, 2006

http://www.jointogether.org/news/headlines/inthenews/2006/dea-exhibit-linking-drugs-and.html or http://tinyurl.com/lusj9

A traveling exhibit from the Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA) juxtaposes War on Drugs images with those of Sept. 11 and Osama bin Laden in making the argument that the drug war and terrorism are intertwined, the Washington Post reported Aug. 12.

The exhibit, dubbed, "Target America: Opening Eyes to the Damage Drugs Cause" and currently at the Chicago Museum of Science and Industry, has drawn protesters from the group Students for Sensible Drug Policy (SSDP), who say it is the drug war itself that fuels the enormous profits that supports terrorists. "If we taxed and regulated drugs, terrorists wouldn't have drugs as a source of profit," said SSDP president Tom Angell.

In Chicago, home of Al Capone, some made the point that the federal government has forgotten the lessons of Prohibition. But DEA spokesman Steve Robertson said, "People say if we didn't have [drug] laws there wouldn't be a problem, but there was a problem before and that's why laws were established."

History teacher Jeanne Barr said she plans to bring her high-school class to the exhibit. "We'll look for possible omissions and oversimplifications," she said. "They don't pin any blame on the prohibition of drugs. But from my understanding of history, the major source of the black market is prohibition. I don't think there's any difference between alcohol prohibition and what we're looking at today."

Despite the linkages the exhibit makes between drugs and 9/11, there's little evidence that al Qaida was funded with drug money. "I don't think we're saying 9/11 was caused by drug financing," said DEA public-affairs director Garrison Courtney. "But we're saying there is a link between drugs and terror, and September 11 is a poignant example of terrorism. Terrorists don't hold bake sales to raise money."

Included in the exhibit is a mockup of a heroin-processing lab from Afghanistan, but the DEA doesn't mention that the former Taliban government ardently opposed heroin production and nearly wiped it out in Afghanistan. "The Taliban said they had a moratorium on the production of opium poppies, but they were taxing the farmers who were doing it anyway," said DEA agent David Lorino. The DEA also claims that the 2004 Madrid train bombings were financed with drug money.

The exhibit opened on Sept. 11, 2003, and has been traveling around the country since.

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #16 posted by global_warming on August 26, 2006 at 12:24:25 PT
there is only One Power
It comes from the stars, it is invisible,

It can fill our hearts and minds

It can transport our souls



[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #15 posted by museman on August 26, 2006 at 12:21:29 PT
g_w
"why have you been wasting yourself as a musician, you are a good teacher, Hallelujah, you have found the root, and it is covered with blood."

Was it wasted?

I think it was the 'blood' that caused me to be somewhat circumspect in my conversations with the world.

We live in unique times. The willingness to embrace new idea, and challenging thought is not prominent, or even evident in the general consiousness. Despite fond (but faulty) reminiscence of the so-called 'consiousness revolution of the '60's' there was little reception for the ideas and concerns which seem so obvious to so many more today. I found that most people were afraid of change, even my own generation (which also began in 'unique times'), and not able to handle the stark and naked truth.

I couln't just 'not do anything.' I had to find a way. Folks like David Crosby, Neil Young, John Lennon -just to scratch the surface- showed me the way to communicate in a way that (usually) didn't provoke someone into wanting to shoot me on the spot. So I took up music as a means to 'soften the blow'-so to speak.

g_w, I have come to recognize that music is the best I have to offer, for the most amount of actual effect (I've been around enough to know it has had effect over the years) over all.

I have recently come into a 'more complete' version of myself-whether that is a 'product' of age, or regaining some chemical balance in acouple of important glands, or just because it 'is time,' I Don't know. Lets just say things are getting clearer all the time.

As far as a 'teacher' goes, I've often thought about what that meant, and as a father I've learned some of the finer points. I sure know that there is knowledge, and understanding IN THE WORLD -cannabis use, and the actual nature and being of Yashua ben Yoseph-as examples- that are deliberately left out of the general curriculum, and the ignorance of the entire race collectively speaking is painful to contemplate, but I believe in the I Am That Which I Am, therefore I believe also that each and every one of us must come to this understanding on their own. If I can aid in this without some kind of martyrdom, then I am willing to help.

FYI, locally there are about a dozen young men (aside from my sons) who frequently discuss these very thoughts as we do here. To them I suppose I am a 'teacher.' But in my mind we are all both teachers and students, young and old. All should embrace truth as they see it, and be bold enough to proclaim it, as well as willing to corrected in their error/s if need be.



[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #14 posted by FoM on August 26, 2006 at 12:12:46 PT
They Say
If you don't like the laws change them. That's how a democracy works. Everytime we do it the way they said they turn around and fight us. What's that? When can we win in anything we do if it is against the powers that be?

[ Post Comment ]
 
Comment #13 posted by global_warming on August 26, 2006 at 12:12:12 PT
re:comment 9
..We have never had a thread that big ..

It is so big, it is only the tip, the blessings of our world try to hide but the stars and the universe can see into our souls, we are children moving closer to God and Understanding, closer and closer.

Hail Cannabis, if this is not news about Cannabis, I can can pour my vodka down the drain.

God Bless You All, it is our time, in this world, we' can change this world, we' can end war.

My Amen to you mm, toke deeply, for the tax collector will soon knock on your door, and this world is nothing but a prison, filled with christian lunatooks and self serving ignorant bigots.



[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #12 posted by charmed quark on August 26, 2006 at 12:03:15 PT
County map of prop. 215 votes
I was looking at a map of the county by county votes on Prop. 215 to see if people in Merced were really against it, at least at the time of the referendum. A majority did vote "NO", but it was only 56%, with 44% yes. So not a very strong no.

More interesting were some of the other counties. San Diego was a clear "yes". San Bernardino was 50/50.

So there was no obvious STRONG disagreement at the time, where people would have felt the state was forcing it down their throats.

I guess these county board members believe they know better than the people of the state.

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #11 posted by whig on August 26, 2006 at 11:55:05 PT
museman
http://cannabisnews.com/news/22/thread22087.shtml#423

Thread's full, couldn't post a response.

I wanted to say Amen.

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #10 posted by The GCW on August 26, 2006 at 11:55:02 PT
Back to Murkowski; US AK: LTE: Out of Touch
Pubdate: Sat, 26 Aug 2006

Source: Ketchikan Daily News (AK)

Viewed at: http://www.ketchikandailynews.com/letters.php

EDITOR, Daily News: Newspapers don't want to mention it, but one reason Frank Murkowski lost his bid for a second term is because of his personal vendetta against cannabis (marijuana /kaneh bosm) when so many citizens do not think it is appropriate to cage humans for using the God-given plant. Cannabis is a blessing to be accepted; not persecuted, prohibited and exterminated. Murkowski’s out of touch and out of contention.

Truthfully, ...



[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #9 posted by FoM on August 26, 2006 at 11:54:06 PT
global_warming
I wish the thread could continue but there must be a limit on the number of comments. We have never had a thread that big so this is a first and I thank everyone who has contributed to it. It's worth being bookmarked for me.

[ Post Comment ]
 
Comment #8 posted by global_warming on August 26, 2006 at 11:52:43 PT
for the good=repost
Comment #423 posted by museman on August 26, 2006 at 11:11:19 PT marshians The poor man has been inundated with response from you all -he shut down his comments, so I couldn't give my own response. Therefore I am left with no recourse but to state it here, hoping he is looking to see what we are saying (I'm sure he is).

Religion: It's definition means to 'constrain, or hold back.'

Religion is a human system, an institution invented by the ruling class to keep the peasants in line. It's the way they've always handled the higher aspects of truth about our creator and his emmissaries of love and intelligence.

Becoming a 'pastor' or an 'ordained minister' is a lot like becoming a politiican; you have to concede to the rules of the game particular to the sect, and effectively close your mind to all other perspectives.

"Religion" and "Church" have never ever had any true relationship to the Most High Creator Spirit called "God" like a disrespectful nickname by those ministers who by virtue of their club-like association consider themselves exclusive in their access to 'the truth.' Y'shua said "When two or more come together in my name, I will be with them."

The whole idea of a manmade structure of any kind being the only place where "God hangs out" is not only very naive, but obviously ignorant as well. The idea that any man or group of people posesses all the truth, or all the facts is the most ridiculous thing to ever come down the pipe. Wasn't it Y'shua who said "Who are you calling good? There is none good but the Father in Heaven!"

And why exactly did He get so pissed when he came to the temple and saw what was being done by the money mongers?

Wasn't it Y'shua who said, "Judge (condemn) not lest you be judged." Do xtians have some kind of exclusive exemption to that? Apparently being a minister gives you mandate to conveniently ignore profound truth while twisting vagueries to suit their purposes -which have always been hand in hand with the conquest and aquisition of power, and property.

About 2 thousand years ago the rest of the first (and only) real xtians -who called themselves gnostic- were persecuted to the ends of the earth by the Romans. Right about the time that the last of the gnostics had fled into the desert, buried their sacred writings so that hopefully one day they would be found, and the truth once more would be circulating in the general human forum, right about the time when the Roman decadence (much like modern America) was causing it to collapse inward -the empire was failing- Constantine created the xtian church, integrated with ancient pagan beliefs, and precepts as old as Sumeria, Babylon, and Egypt. The church was founded on the cornerstone of fear-rejecting the stone of faith and belief which Y'shua exemplified.

The only reason Y'shua's truth comes down to us 2 millennia later somewhat intact (though definitely incomplete) is because the early founders of the church could not understand His teachings, so they figured the 'ignorant masses' wouldn't either. The church and religion of 'Jesus Christ' (the name and character who is a total invention of the Roman Catholic Church) is corrupt, rotten in it's inception and it's core.

Y'shua said, "If the heart of the tree is rotten wherefore is it's fruit?"

All xtian religion are branches on the same rotten tree. The accountability will be held. Those who accept the false authority and stature of xtian 'ministry' will be held in greater responsibility than those who have been made ignorant by their false doctrines and teachings. As Y'shua said, "To those who have, much will be given. To those who have not, even what they have will be taken away."

Guilt and sin (not error, mistake, or wrongdoing) are power tools of both the church and state.

Y'shua said "The Truth shall set you free." He told me when I was eight years old that He wasn't in the 'church.' After nearly thirty years of giving the xtian church all the opportunity to 'come clean' I finally had to accept that they were too firmly entrenched in their error, and that there is nothing about that institution -in any denomination that is worth saving.

The same thing goes for our system of government, and the system of weights and measures which rules by the invented-but heavily enforced- system of wealth and propriety.

And war. Don't forget war. Who propagates it? Who tells the young men that "God is on our side?" Who sent children, time and time again to their certain death claiming somekind of divine ordination to destroy, murder, maim, rape, and pillage? "In the name of 'jesus christ' our cause is just!"

Y'shua said; "What you have done to these, the least of my brethren, you have done to me."

I thank the Most High Creator YHWH that, as Y'hua said "...the truth is revealed to babes. And those who think themselves wise will be confounded."

And cannabis. It's true that the precepts and doctrines of the church have made numerous claims about cannabis and it's relationship to 'witchcraft.' The 'loving, forgiving, tolerant church would gladly (and fervently) get hysterical and burn you for it. The fact that cannabis was used in the holy annointing oil used by both the Levites, and of course John the Baptist is a secret they thought to have buried along with all the other great truths of Y'shua and the Most High. The fact that it was a major ingredient in the temple incense, and therefore referred to in the Revelation of John when he states that the 'Prayers of the 'saints' (holy men) go up like the smoke of incense to Heaven.'

This is the age of Revelation. Some call it 'the last days.' It is truly the last days of such ignorance and error as exalted in the xtian church, and in the society that is rooted in those ancient deliberate misconceptions of reality and the divine called the xtian religion, and the church. No religion is real. Faith and belief of the kind Y'shua asked for when he said, "Love each other as I have loved you." are not contained within them. Never were, and never will be.

Y'shua said, "When you pray, pray in secret." Isn't that enough of a clue?"

As Y'shua was recorded to have said as he was dying, "Forgive them Father, for they know not what they do."

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #7 posted by global_warming on August 26, 2006 at 11:45:31 PT
and then
Sorry

The web page you requested, /news/22/thread22087, is under construction, no longer exists or never existed.

Imagine that, me working for you..

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #6 posted by global_warming on August 26, 2006 at 11:43:01 PT
re:
http://www.cannabisnews.com/news/22/thread22087

museman

Like that lost pastor, why have you been wasting yourself as a musician, you are a good teacher, Hallelujah, you have found the root, and it is covered with blood.

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #5 posted by global_warming on August 26, 2006 at 11:36:52 PT
ok
so there is a limit

and there is a limit to this injustice and cruelty

it is time to receive our place in this world

Hail Cannabis

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #4 posted by FoM on August 26, 2006 at 11:33:15 PT
Museman and Everyone
It's our heart condition that should be what is important. It is very sad for me to see so many following in the wrong footsteps. Mercy, love, compassion, not killing, being long suffering and kind was what would show who His followers really were. I guess I read too much of the Bible and not enough about history.

PS: I think the thread can't get any bigger. It said:

ERROR!! Sorry, no more space for messages...please post later

http://cannabisnews.com/news/22/thread22087.shtml#423

[ Post Comment ]

 
Comment #3 posted by global_warming on August 26, 2006 at 11:29:58 PT
fomme
what is going on, cannot post

[ Post Comment ]
 
Comment #2 posted by museman on August 26, 2006 at 11:23:25 PT
well
Republicans, xtians, and rich men, OH my! To the right, to the right...and they all fall down.

[ Post Comment ]
 
Comment #1 posted by OverwhelmSam on August 26, 2006 at 11:12:15 PT
Forgive Them Father, They Know Not What They Do
Go ahead, strike down medical marijuana laws. Full legalization and regulation is the alternative.

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